E072: Why You Shouldn’t Run a Sweepstakes, Holiday Season Advertising, Temu’s Earnings & More

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Alright, welcome back episode 72 of The Operators Pot. Before we get into the agenda, thank you to our sponsors today, NorthBeam, Bofil and PostGrip. Without them there is no pod. Today's gonna be a fun one. We are gonna go cross the board of consumer. We're gonna start by Sean convincing us why you should never run sweeps. Right? Everybody here is about the ridge sweeps. They give away cars. It's a whole big thing. It's really successful for them. He's gonna try to convince us not to do it today. Then we are gonna go into a little bit of Q4. So like,

[00:00:29] [SPEAKER_03]: it's August, late August right now when we're recording this. We want to talk about what's coming with Q4 and how we're thinking about some things. We have to talk about Timo, earnings just came out. So that's top of three. And Jason is gonna bring his home with a little panzerism. He come grandpa himself. He's gonna drop some wisdom. You can hear Sean and I is reaction to it. Stick around to the end for that one. Episode 72, Let's Get Into It.

[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Guys, I want to talk to you about Fafil, one of the sponsors of The Pod and why we are big fans. They have built a modern ERP that is built in the world.

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_01]: They're built for digital entrepreneurs that want to keep their books in order and want to make sure that they're driving their business forward, have good reporting and good visibility into their inventory,

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_01]: in towards the financials. These are things you have to have to grow and Fafil has done a great job of it. One of the things I love about the company, their bootstrapped.

[00:01:32] [SPEAKER_01]: They don't have outside investors. So they're able to build the company the right way from their pricing model to how they add features.

[00:01:38] [SPEAKER_01]: They've been able to do it in a way that's entrepreneur friendly. Sean uses them. They're a great product. I would encourage everybody to check them out. Fafil, thanks for being a sponsor of The Pod.

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Alright, let's get into it. Sean, why don't you kick us off today and tell us why we should not do a sweeps?

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I've gotten tons of text and emails and every year we do the, like this is our fourth year of doing sweeps. Every time we do one people are like,

[00:02:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to do one too. It's going to be so awesome, right? And there was a deck floating around from like a very popular CRO agency that was like, you should do a sweeps takes like rich.

[00:02:17] [SPEAKER_02]: And there's another wallet company out there. I like the Twitter and direct competitor, but they decided to do a $50,000 sweeps giveaway right now.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm sure it's not going to work out. And I'm going to explain other reasons why you shouldn't do a sweeps takes.

[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_04]: Sean, by the way, I'm going to kick your ass because like you guys knew we're doing one.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_04]: And my team has been working on this for months and we're about to launch what, and now you're telling me not to do it. So but we'll do that after.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, I mean, we are sweeps takes turns the summer months into eight figure months, right?

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_02]: So this August this September we're going to do at least eight figures in revenue each week, each one of these months. So you can make a ton of money doing these sweeps takes,

[00:03:03] [SPEAKER_02]: but people just trying to like shoe horn a sweep takes into their brand.

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I think just feels very pass A right? The way Jason is going to do a sweep, I think is going to work because he has like a unique angle to it, right? So we'll go to the history of us doing the sweep takes.

[00:03:20] [SPEAKER_02]: I learned about it at a Nick shackle for event. I was at geek out, some guys like I do sweeps you should do one two and we already sell something for a car right our key case is if it's like your car keys on it and like okay so it's kind of car adjacent we love out off of roting like we got into sweeps like the year of the pandemic and so all of this pot cheap so he just went out to the road like like the desert all the time.

[00:03:45] [SPEAKER_02]: So it made sense for us to get into it a little bit, but the first year wasn't fantastic right and like every year we've had out the stakes and like now we have a sweep's where we leave partnership with Hannesie which is the cool list you know independent car maker good exists.

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_02]: It's our third year of doing it. We have customized products with them. We have a cyber truck we're giving away with a customized cyber truck product right and then we taking these cars and we're putting them in 20 plus youtubers videos.

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like just so holistically planned out and I can't tell you how much of pain in the ass it is to get cars and youtubers videos right because they're all across the country.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_02]: And we have two trucks that we have to get places so one person can drive them need two people to drive the trucks there and then two people to Uber back right.

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And like this car started in Texas where we picked it up and went to New Jersey and went to Utah and went to LA and went back to Utah and went back to LA and like you have like people on driving those places we're getting them free to the ground so it's super expensive.

[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_02]: And then you got to deal with a bunch of people who were cars up. So like the cars have had speeding tickets they've had flat tires they've had keys locked in them we've had keys lost and the worst part is the cyber truck has a panel of a felt like one I think the roof at the cyber truck like a panel fell off and now on the side of panel fell off and the cyber trucks gold plated we can't just get spare parts they have to be cold.

[00:05:19] [SPEAKER_02]: It is it is such a logistical pain in the ass to get this you're describing Costco roadshow. That's why I'm laughing.

[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, like everyone is like all I'm going to do a sweep like it seems like a such a money maker like you don't know what I'm saying that we had to put up a half a million dollars in cars right I bought cars.

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_02]: And I bought the cars six months ago or eight months ago to shoot content with them then I have to spate pay for the transit pay for youtubers dude being insurance because 20 youtubers are driving it so you've to add everybody to the insurance so that they if like.

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_02]: Because yeah it is just such a pain in the ass so I think people should look at doing sweep sexes it's a really fun summer event.

[00:06:04] [SPEAKER_02]: But we've had other people like just try to give away your car to and like this is not our unique thing we I still the idea from somebody else but when I still the idea I also thought it was going to be easy but this is the fourth year of doing it and you just have to continue to integrate into your business right like how long you do it for.

[00:06:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Like the partners you bring on this is the best we've ever done and like the results show it right we're able to grow.

[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_02]: At least 50% plus year over year during a really strong sweep last year and that's because we have new products integrated products like all of these cool.

[00:06:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Integrations with youtubers and whatever else so just something to throw out there that it's not as easy as it looks.

[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_03]: Sean do you what did you see in the first year that made you keep going this is a pattern with you by the way because remember I don't remember if you remember you're talking about your initial father's day.

[00:06:52] [SPEAKER_03]: When you guys first tried to make father's day thing you were like it just didn't work that well in the first year and then by the third or fourth year you're like okay now father's days is really big moment for the brand.

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_03]: What did you see in year one they were like okay that was okay but.

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Like why why repeat it I guess for those people listening we yeah because the first of me do anything it's going to suck.

[00:07:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Like the first the first ad you make the first landing page the first product is always kind of suck like every time we launched a lot of products to and the first version of them it's like you know it's like a prototype like when you release it you have to see what breaks then you know you can improve it over time.

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_02]: The reason why we kept doing it I think the main reason was the content looked really good it was the first time we had like a good ad.

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Because like it was like in the world cars driving off-roading we had actors like we had like there was a thunder storm we captured like it was just really amazing content and that was.

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_02]: So refreshing for us because we've shot a person holding wallet has been the only ad for.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Eight years ago.

[00:08:01] [SPEAKER_02]: It just gave us a new canvas to like tell a story on so that's probably why we kept doing it and I think the second year we got had a sea involved and then we had like a better carpet about the first year was a second gladiator we picked up already tricked out.

[00:08:12] [SPEAKER_02]: And the second year like bronco shows came out and we were able to get one of those so it's just like new all love cars like.

[00:08:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Rages and organization owns a couple porches.

[00:08:23] [SPEAKER_02]: So yeah that's what we kept doing it even though I can probably wasn't rather than a creative it probably wasn't profitable the first year.

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_02]: It just let us shoot ads like we were just not allowed to normally if we just shot cars off-roading and then like buy a wallet.

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I would be very, very stupid.

[00:08:38] [SPEAKER_03]: So your guide I guess like that what I'm taking away is you shouldn't just give away a car like if you're listening to this like that's that's probably a bad idea as a brand but there's like what Jason's going to do is very.

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Brand experience integrated right like it makes sense for what he's going to do and other brands can probably find things that like for their audience actually do totally work.

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah we're also in just the year of or you know the past couple years there's been an explosion of like give away poron basically like your competing attention versus Mr. Beast right so like other example they're like yeah we're going to give away $8000 I don't like nobody cares.

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Now like I'm like $8000 I'm like Mr. Beast gives away a half a million dollars and there's a child in their storytelling involved so then the prices be compelling I think.

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_02]: It has to be integrated in the brand naturally which I think Jason's doing a really great job of like Jason's got offer once the life's time experience that like it's just really hard to get someplace else and.

[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_02]: The next level which I think Jason will have to be next year is integrated product experiences so like we have.

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Look the best in wilds during sweep or the head and see wallet and the cyber truck wallet like.

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_02]: Those are only offered this time of year and they're cool and you need people buy a second one or third one getting people to buy a second wallet is like getting somebody to donate a kid.

[00:10:01] [SPEAKER_02]: It's like really, really hard so.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if I put those in the same category but she.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I've never gotten people to donate kidnames but I've tried a lot of second wall.

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah well that's it's just a great example of you know, not everything that works for your brand is going to work for someone else's and this is like this herd mentality and group think out there that you is it that's a part of human nature.

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_04]: Like the idea of doing a sweep at a certain part of year of the year that is typically quiet for your business and for our business it just it just makes it time of sense.

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_04]: And I will I will echo shons comments in the fact that that it administratively is a lot of work there are legal issues to.

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_04]: You know the stuff cost money you know it definitely adds up you got to dot all your eyes and across all your teas or you or you can't get in trouble.

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_04]: We did like a monster content shoot for it like all this stuff.

[00:11:08] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, all this stuff adds up I think our sweep takes going to crush we have some really unique stuff you know we have Gordon.

[00:11:17] [SPEAKER_04]: I don't want to give away too much about it but it's it's involving Gordon Ramsay which is incredible and.

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_04]: So it's going to be fun. And we actually and we thought through a lot we had like different ideas of how to do it and there was a certain time timing component that will allow us to do this this particular sweeps this year and it will actually never happen again.

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_04]: So we'll have to come you know V 2 will like Sean has to iterate you know he's on V whatever V 2 will have to be it's going to be really hard to top this one.

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_04]: So what when do you launch can you say what what yeah it's going to be like mid September.

[00:11:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh right on it okay yeah yeah after school crazy yeah.

[00:12:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's great to launch a time period where you don't have anything else going on and.

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_02]: There's other brands who like it's their whole thing every quarter like they give away a car or give away something like you know a quarterly sweeps.

[00:12:17] [SPEAKER_02]: I would really play around with time duration because we like we we started with 60 days we brought down a 45 days we might do 30 days next year because at a certain point it gets pretty boring.

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_02]: And then it's like really hard to pull everything off in 30 days right like it's at least a half million dollars to pull off the sweeps like we do probably more when you had everything else and like.

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_02]: The social media comments are so annoying and mean sometimes so like it's just you just plant plan for getting punched in the face a couple times you're going to do one of these like everything else this unique you just like the internet's going to come and kick your ass man.

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And how I guess the question I have Sean the thing I've always thought about is like how much does this sweeps.

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Set up your Q4 from a demand creation like future demand creation you know you run it in August.

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Q4's kind of around the corner you get a ton of email ton of traffic ton of phone numbers like you track that I'm going to make sure you guys do but like how much of this drives future performance.

[00:13:18] [SPEAKER_02]: It's over a million SMS signups. So what's like it? Yeah, it's like a ton of it's like a ton of people sign up for this thing and we'll send those SMS is via post script fun additional sponsor of the pod right.

[00:13:35] [SPEAKER_02]: It is Q4 seeding the one the real reason why we kept doing it after 2021 which like probably we've lost money on made me remember money who knows.

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Was that it just allowed us to reach more people on Facebook at lower CPMs right and that was a security day campaign that was August and September so going into Q4.

[00:13:55] [SPEAKER_02]: Because we had the unique content we've never shop before like the rolling reach of net like met new people frequency everything all those read metrics on meta like got hell of boosted we're able to reach way more people way lower CPMs just because the content was so compelling.

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, I mean we've had strong Q4s so hopefully hopefully this is plays a part in it and we'll all over pork back in January what the sweep segment of SMS ended up driving but yeah, I'm so curious.

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we've really gamified the whole thing I think like this is this is by far the best we've ever done we have like mystery entries we have mystery wallet like just really making try to feel like a fine game and I mean.

[00:14:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Like year over year if you adjust for the time period because we've launched differently like sweep does up 100% year over year so.

[00:14:45] [SPEAKER_03]: We've definitely leaned into it Jason I'm also curious how yours does because you do have a decent consideration window right I get your price point like so in September.

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if you actually see in a like a compression of of that audience from when they discover not that I think anybody hasn't heard it hex clad yet.

[00:15:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean it's just a bit weird but like there's going to be some amount of data that's going to show up we like hey these people are all new I wonder if they move faster.

[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_04]: From first touch to purchase because of the timing yeah it's going to be interesting we you know it's funny that the hearing about hex clad blah blah blah I actually think there's a ton of people who haven't heard of hex clad.

[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_04]: That's crazy is that may seem at this stage because number one I think the meta algorithm is just so it's really hard to find people that are not like top of funnel brand awareness I keep getting you know this is just hard and reaching even RTV spend which is up a lot which I think is the best way to create reach and brand awareness.

[00:15:50] [SPEAKER_04]: It's not massive it's like not not even close to massive.

[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_04]: We talked about this all the time I keep fighting with the team about this I'm like let's slash meta and half and give that all the TV and just see what happens and I'm the push back I always get is you're going to kill the next you know four months from now because of our long consideration period and our conversion lag and I'm just like.

[00:16:15] [SPEAKER_04]: I'll tell you what people who are in a funnel or they're either like on meta they get in plenty of our ads you like they're getting plenty I know you know but like it's the people that aren't getting any and it's just it's just like this.

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_04]: It's like this very does bifurcated thing here that I feel like is just like we haven't no one has convinced me yet that I'm wrong so there's some right.

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_02]: I think you said on a couple of podcasts or maybe as a sin to the operators subscribe to the marketing operators podcast that 26% of people in the country are in markets for premium.

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's a very good idea for a few guys who are in the market to do it.

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean this is probably good for the people who have to buy a few companies that work on this, really is a better way to deal with these.

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_02]: If you just do the math basically three-four so people probably haven't heard about you.

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Like, and you should cut that in half because half of those people just probably will

[00:17:03] [SPEAKER_02]: never buy hex-clad like they don't cook. It's not their price point whatever. But 26% of

[00:17:08] [SPEAKER_02]: people definitely have heard about you. And that means there's probably half the country

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_02]: still left the conquer. And yeah, you're probably right. Those people are harder to find on

[00:17:17] [SPEAKER_02]: meta-use in the same tools. I think slowly over time, additional 1% will enter into that market

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_02]: as people move, look for housing and then redo their kitchens. They'll get into that market

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_02]: over time. So maybe 26% this year, next year, 30% year after maybe 33, where you can definitely

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_02]: jump start that by just finding people off meta and pushing them in. What I think half of your

[00:17:40] [SPEAKER_02]: meta budget and put it in this TV, I don't know if I would do that, but I would definitely experiment

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_02]: with other unique placements for sure. I just, I don't believe in TV as a platform.

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_02]: At that level of scale, I think TV is good and you should definitely spend money on TV.

[00:17:58] [SPEAKER_02]: But we're talking, do you want to go from let's just call it 100k a month to 2 million a month?

[00:18:04] [SPEAKER_04]: That's crazy. Yeah, I'm exaggerating, but I think our mix has the change in that direction.

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Sean, can you back up tell me why don't you believe in TV at that's kind of scale?

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Like it isn't it still a significant chunk of advertising dollars in America goes into television.

[00:18:26] [SPEAKER_03]: This is like huge percentage population that consumes a lot of media there.

[00:18:30] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think it's 40% of add dollars are spent on TV, but 10 years ago,

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_02]: it was 90% of add dollars for spending. Be sure. Yeah.

[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think there's probably a better use for that money. Should Jason,

[00:18:50] [SPEAKER_02]: but let's say Jason currently spend the $100,000 a month on TV and he's talking about going to a

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_02]: million. I think he could probably spend 400 grand on TV pretty effectively, but then the rest of

[00:19:00] [SPEAKER_02]: the money I would put into just non-meta advertising channels. Like, I mean, look, Jason does influence

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_02]: or better than anybody, but I just do more influencer and I'd get out of the cooking influence

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_02]: space that's what I would do. I would go into, I mean, tech influencers just like I would I would have

[00:19:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Linus tech tips amazing partner of ours. We have a wallet coming out in a couple of weeks to

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_02]: with them out of Linus tech tips just be like, yeah, hey, you buy computers at a three grand.

[00:19:26] [SPEAKER_02]: How would you like a pants? That's not right. I'm not writing scripts for Linus.

[00:19:36] [SPEAKER_04]: Worst transition in history. By the way, if you want to see if you guys want to laugh later,

[00:19:41] [SPEAKER_04]: you guys should go on the cooking influence or something. This is guy called Chef Reactions.

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_04]: He's just like this deadpan really sarcastic East Coast chef and he's freaking hilarious. Like,

[00:19:54] [SPEAKER_04]: if you need, if you need laughs, just go listen to his just go watch. Go to scroll through his

[00:19:58] [SPEAKER_04]: feed on TikTok or Instagram. He looks like our ages. Yeah, kind of free Chef Reactions.

[00:20:07] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, God. It's good. Yeah. So good. You want to hear something weird? Jason Calicanus invested in this guy.

[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Like I don't know what the business is. Yeah. But Jason Calicanus talked about investing in

[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Chef Reaction. So stop. He's prolific though. He invests in like that's that's just like a unreal

[00:20:26] [SPEAKER_03]: amount of deals that he's putting out here in the given year. It's crazy.

[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Functioning so you can get amazing data out of the ecosystem. They will be more hands on than any

[00:21:05] [SPEAKER_02]: meta-requival of a bee and they're going to help you understand where your add dollars are best

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_02]: spent, best position in which you add to working. My team works with the NorthBean team.

[00:21:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Literally every day they're in my slack. Maybe you don't get the same level of support as an operator.

[00:21:20] [SPEAKER_02]: But they will be there to make sure it's working. And if you're not happy at all, just email

[00:21:25] [SPEAKER_02]: us and he will take care of you. We use NorthBean every day. It's a benchmarking tool. It's super helpful

[00:21:31] [SPEAKER_02]: for forecasting, daily pacing, interhour pacing so we can see like if we just launch an add in two

[00:21:37] [SPEAKER_02]: hours if it's working or not, that's what NorthBean does for us. So thank you NorthBean for the support.

[00:21:42] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm customer probably number one. So thank you so much. One thing to add regarding NorthBean

[00:21:47] [SPEAKER_04]: because we just went through contract renewal with them on their specifically on the MMM.

[00:21:54] [SPEAKER_04]: And we got a pretty sweet heart deal and I expect them to come back to us and raise our

[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_04]: price and kind of deserve. I was like let me reach out to the team and see how it's going

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_04]: right because I'm not in the day-to-day that get feedback and the team was like they have improved

[00:22:11] [SPEAKER_04]: the MMM so much since we started it that there were like we should definitely pay for this increase.

[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_04]: And my team hates every agency and most SaaS. The only person that hates SaaS,

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_04]: the only more than my team is Sean Frank. But yeah I mean they came to us or like hey you guys

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_04]: got the sweet heart deal we won the first MMM clients and I was very, very pleased when my team was

[00:22:43] [SPEAKER_04]: like it's really working well for us. So that's my little MMM plug. What just to back up for

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_03]: second though, this Q4 thing, Sean how, I guess in your seat and Jason yours when you guys plan

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_03]: ahead right now like we're beyond the inventory piece. We've talked about that like Q4 planning from

[00:23:06] [SPEAKER_03]: a volume of like supply volume that happens I guess for a lot of us that would happen to

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_03]: while it go. How do you think about demand creation in Q4 or do you think about it at all or is

[00:23:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Q4 just like no man this is who's in market their market that's kind of what we're going for

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_03]: or are you looking for like net new eyeballs I guess is what I'm going for and how do you think about

[00:23:29] [SPEAKER_03]: like percentage of the business and the forecast it's going to be based on that. Okay I'll go first

[00:23:34] [SPEAKER_02]: then we'll cure with Jason. I think I'm probably pretty similar to Jason where like about half

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_02]: of our revenue happens in Q4. Sometimes some years it's 45% some years it's 55% but they're basically

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_02]: half of our revenue is gonna come this Q4 and that's with Father's Day in sweeps and anniversary

[00:23:52] [SPEAKER_02]: sale and everything we do for the first three fours of the year like you just can't match the

[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_02]: people who are just in demand for for gift giving for holidays. So I don't think we really influence

[00:24:02] [SPEAKER_02]: all that much who's in market for gift giving we just have to be there a great offer to like

[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_02]: you know win over those people. There's a very viral tweet that's going around right now that men

[00:24:12] [SPEAKER_02]: have never bought a wallet and every wall it's been given to them. It has like 500,000 likes on Twitter

[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_02]: right like posted on like me and the count of Instagram and I'm like yeah it's true. Like

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_02]: I got to know what's controversial there we sell wallets to wives, girlfriends, kids, brothers

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_02]: and they just give it to somebody else right because it's a perfect gift it's uniform it's there's no

[00:24:34] [SPEAKER_02]: sizing so that's the wallet business. This is just capturing the demand that exists in a gift giving space

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_02]: having the best offer the cool stuff and like satisfying all of this pain points. For the ring business

[00:24:45] [SPEAKER_02]: it is actually trying to like you know a lot of people get engaged in married and in December

[00:24:50] [SPEAKER_02]: that used to not be a trend I think in the past 20 years it's really shifted from summer weddings

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_02]: to winter weddings probably 30% of all weddings are happening in December at this point.

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_02]: And so it's just captured like that it that is also just like getting our name out there to like

[00:25:05] [SPEAKER_02]: we are an option for men's wedding bands and then travels the unique one. We could not run

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_02]: travel ads last year. We just didn't have the stock there was hold out by December. I mean we should

[00:25:15] [SPEAKER_02]: have enough stock to do $5 million in travel in November if we wanted to so we're going to see if

[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_02]: we can do that that is that is you know a new form of like net eyeball expansion for us is like

[00:25:28] [SPEAKER_02]: we've never had a travel offering before in P. coliday we're going to try to get out there and win those

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_02]: but Jason are you got 50% of your revenue happening Q4? Yeah I probably in between 40 and 50

[00:25:39] [SPEAKER_04]: I would say in the middle midpoint of that. You know it's a big purchase we sell big bundles

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_04]: you know $400 AoV and and that's like that's just an average you know we have with a lot of people buying

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_04]: a 12% which is 699 retail and then you have some people coming in and that you really can't buy

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_04]: it by much for under like 150 bucks from us so you kind of average roll out and it comes out to

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER_04]: the 400 so we just know people are waiting I mean I get people hit me up like business contacts

[00:26:15] [SPEAKER_04]: it's like hey your Labor Day sale is on is that the best sale or shut-eye weight to BFCN? I hate

[00:26:24] [SPEAKER_04]: you know I get it and like we actually last year it's funny we've been having this conversation

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_04]: internally because I think consumer demand is definitely down this year our numbers are still great

[00:26:36] [SPEAKER_04]: but they're they're not like the sort of windmill dunking on the world like like last year

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_04]: in the year before and one of the things that we did last year for the first time is we really

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_04]: legitimately saved our best deal for Black Friday um in the previous years we would run that same

[00:26:55] [SPEAKER_04]: sort of deal three to six times a year and we held it for Black Friday last year and it definitely worked

[00:27:05] [SPEAKER_04]: and then with one of the things that I kind of woke up like a month ago when I'm looking at our numbers

[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_04]: and I'm like shit like maybe last year was the anomaly and we should actually run that really good

[00:27:14] [SPEAKER_04]: deal maybe three times a year maybe not six and it's kind of too late now and maybe maybe we could

[00:27:20] [SPEAKER_04]: do it during prime because we can do like just really quick shot for three days and that's actually

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_04]: a question um maybe to deal with and another one free I'll do that in chat actually because I

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_04]: I actually would like everyone's thoughts on that like is is running a really great deal now

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_04]: going to take away from BFCM as we get closer but you know that's it we we run our best possible

[00:27:49] [SPEAKER_04]: deal I continue to think that with our conversion lag in our wrong consideration period

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_04]: we've been spending and we spend a ton of money we've been spending a ton of money and I do think that

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_04]: I think the consumer is waiting and and like literally has to show up in November like they have

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_04]: and like Sean said there are some people that you know they're just waiting that's just that's the

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_04]: shopping time I do think you this is my prediction the consumer is really gonna show up in November

[00:28:19] [SPEAKER_04]: and December for the right businesses in our industry okay my question Jason is

[00:28:27] [SPEAKER_02]: what percentage of your Q4 sales are gift giving or gift for self like how does it actually split

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm 80% gift giving or more whoa yeah we're definitely much lower than that

[00:28:40] [SPEAKER_04]: I think it's like people are like waiting to pull the trigger on a purchase it's it's hard like

[00:28:46] [SPEAKER_04]: it's same I think it's like same household maybe it's gift giving maybe it's husband for why

[00:28:51] [SPEAKER_04]: for wife or husband and we do definitely get a lot of that but yeah I'll grab that data I don't

[00:28:56] [SPEAKER_04]: have any handy I'll grab that data I but it's definitely I think it'd be considered with lower

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_03]: me's hot there Sean just like I think it's not 80 but I think in Q4 we do a ton of our revenue

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_03]: and I think it's more it's probably 60% of our revenue for the years in Q4

[00:29:12] [SPEAKER_03]: and it's mostly gift giving I want to say it's like 60% 50% 50% gift for someone else

[00:29:19] [SPEAKER_02]: yeah because I think you should think about the business differently if you're a gift for self or

[00:29:23] [SPEAKER_02]: gift for others right and like like gift for others you have to make it really really you

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_02]: shop for somebody and they're has to just be these national price points for fall with right

[00:29:33] [SPEAKER_02]: like Jason if you're buying something for your cousin it's a hundred bucks I'm not spending

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_02]: more than a hundred bucks in my goddamn cousin right something like that and so you know if you

[00:29:42] [SPEAKER_02]: are a strong gift giving product you have to give people those on ramps where it's like hey I'm

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_02]: getting a lot of value for whatever price point and I'm on hair flat right now and you have

[00:29:51] [SPEAKER_02]: you know the eight inch hybrid fry pan you have the seven inch with a lid like that's a 129

[00:29:58] [SPEAKER_02]: if you're trying to have a good gift for others right and I run a separate funnel for this it

[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_02]: would be 99 dollar pan right with a lid like with a bow like I buy a bunch of I would buy

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_02]: ribbon and it'd be like a comes with ribbon and it comes with this this is how you're going to give

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_02]: it to them and it's 99 bucks or 95 bucks like really simple free shipping on top of that

[00:30:17] [SPEAKER_02]: but then if you're a gift for yourself right like a lot of a pair of brands are you just run

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_02]: your best your best deal on your biggest bundle right like that's where you can get higher AOVs

[00:30:28] [SPEAKER_02]: if we're selling luggage it's gift for self it's people buying luggage for themselves so I can spend

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_02]: they'll spend 500 bucks but how many people in your life would you buy a 500 dollar gift for

[00:30:39] [SPEAKER_03]: right immediate family of course yeah that's basically it right yeah like think about the majority

[00:30:46] [SPEAKER_03]: of the population Sean you're bang on didn't you wasn't a ridge the whole thing around like

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_03]: this is your gift for your uncle Jim or something like you had the like your custom ravitar

[00:30:56] [SPEAKER_03]: for gift giving was that that estranged uncle you know like I don't know to buy that guy we got

[00:31:01] [SPEAKER_02]: to get something for him yeah or like yeah imagine you're going to like a white elephant party it's like

[00:31:05] [SPEAKER_02]: it's like it's like it's like it's like look I'm gonna 100 a hundred dollar gift for white elephant

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I know any guy needs a wallet and this will fit them it's like so simple I like it I think

[00:31:17] [SPEAKER_02]: the seven inch fried pan with like could be the exact same thing I would bring that to an

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_02]: office party away to elephant party and it's like you know it'd be 95 bucks out the door and like

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_02]: it's just such a simple easy yes gift we're meant you're both of your products way harder to

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_02]: give gift because I don't know we're fucking iPhone you have most people don't know what iPhone they

[00:31:38] [SPEAKER_02]: and then it's like yeah 30 bucks it has to be a gift for the house it's yeah loamy is a gift for

[00:31:44] [SPEAKER_03]: self or a gift for spouse or you know we get a lot of we get a lot of parents gift like older

[00:31:50] [SPEAKER_03]: parents gifting to their kids so like parents in their 50s and 60s gifting to their millennial

[00:31:56] [SPEAKER_03]: gen X children that's probably our biggest gift in category in the holidays and then for

[00:32:03] [SPEAKER_03]: really case it's basically gift for self like who are we kidding tell my team is like all the time

[00:32:08] [SPEAKER_03]: like don't make ads targeting people like don't make an ad or a piece of content that's like

[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_03]: you're gonna give this as a gift to somebody else I don't know what phone any of my friends have

[00:32:18] [SPEAKER_02]: but like and now we're you could I mean Mike's not on here but you know Mike does the

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_02]: spooky water bottles yeah he thought you were an August you I would immediately copy all those designs

[00:32:29] [SPEAKER_02]: yes 20 on the Saturday like just rip everything off from simple modern spooky phone case and then

[00:32:37] [SPEAKER_02]: as soon as like October 18 hits I would go holiday phone case yeah yeah thanks completely

[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_03]: every year we do it yeah they're probably print so good yeah that but it's the I think

[00:32:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Sean you're hitting on a really important thing just for offer and then for content right it's like

[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_03]: what's the offer that's gonna that is like most tuned who's giving a gift and then what kind of

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_03]: content are you actually putting out there to prime that pump leading into it and then when do you

[00:33:07] [SPEAKER_03]: when do you ramp up your Q4 advertising Jason this probably more for you because long

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_03]: considerations like all but when are you thinking about this like we need to start sort of like soaking

[00:33:20] [SPEAKER_03]: the sponge what what day especially this year we've got an election coming right advertising for

[00:33:28] [SPEAKER_03]: that election is going to be insane in October I think how are you thinking about that this year

[00:33:36] [SPEAKER_04]: talking about insane like every time I try to watch a YouTube video I see Donald Trump now

[00:33:40] [SPEAKER_04]: it's like crazy yeah we start we start spending into it to to an extent right like

[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_04]: imagining thinking about how we're spending as early as as early as September definitely October

[00:33:57] [SPEAKER_04]: it's that again goes back to that argument of like are we spending too much on meta bubble

[00:34:02] [SPEAKER_04]: blood it's like we the the thought is that if we really cut back in September October

[00:34:11] [SPEAKER_04]: it's it's going to hurt us later and that's the that's the the internal um the process really

[00:34:21] [SPEAKER_04]: is like we are focused we are spending late September early October at least willing to accept

[00:34:31] [SPEAKER_04]: lower mirror willing to accept lower row as and higher cack knowing that we are going to perform

[00:34:42] [SPEAKER_04]: really well in November December the question is always well do we need to do it

[00:34:47] [SPEAKER_04]: and that's just that's like the hardest possible problem to solve in our business so

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_04]: but at least the way we think about it in the way it's worked fine since 2020 when I started doing this

[00:35:00] [SPEAKER_04]: we know that we are going to accept lower efficiency in September October because

[00:35:08] [SPEAKER_04]: it's gonna be our our efficiency in November December it's always on the charts yeah I'm pretty

[00:35:15] [SPEAKER_02]: similar I mean September we're gonna crash it it'll be a three X and we are month October last year

[00:35:20] [SPEAKER_02]: I think we ended the month of like a 1.87 so the lowest M.E.R. we've ever seen in this business and it's

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_02]: because you just want to spend a ton of money feeling the funnel right and your stuff you can just

[00:35:30] [SPEAKER_02]: commit to uh then November we actually don't have a very high M.E.R. it's like probably two two to

[00:35:37] [SPEAKER_02]: two five and then December is when we actually turn off all ads and just cash it in and that

[00:35:42] [SPEAKER_04]: could be a four or five X M.E.R. month so um let's double click on that Sean let's double click that

[00:35:48] [SPEAKER_04]: Sean so of course you're not showing off entirely but you're cutting as a lot like how much

[00:35:53] [SPEAKER_02]: would you cut in December well all this is round numbers if we're spending 10 million in November

[00:35:59] [SPEAKER_02]: we would probably spend three and a half in December it's like a it's like a huge drop off

[00:36:06] [SPEAKER_02]: just because you know we're gonna run last chance but like a lot of it is just going to be

[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_02]: we we have to stop advertising on the 15th right like that gives you two days of processing maybe

[00:36:18] [SPEAKER_02]: three days of processing you get all the orders out so people are pissed off and then Amazon

[00:36:22] [SPEAKER_02]: really picks up for that last week like that's when we have the biggest Amazon days of the year

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_02]: so I mean it it I mean it could be a 60% spend decline versus November um so it's very bumpy

[00:36:37] [SPEAKER_02]: probably it goes like you know five million in spending October 10 million in November and then

[00:36:43] [SPEAKER_02]: you know maybe four in December that makes sense that's useful like that that's super useful yeah

[00:36:49] [SPEAKER_03]: yeah I've always wondered how I don't I think we kept adds on a little too hard in December last year

[00:36:58] [SPEAKER_03]: and this year we've been chatting about um pulling back a bit like you have to pull back at a certain

[00:37:03] [SPEAKER_03]: time anyway because shipping caught off but I just think in general people who are in fun with

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_02]: the buyer gonna buy and at that point yeah totally and I mean this this year's unique because I mean

[00:37:14] [SPEAKER_02]: last year we had team move this year we have you know political but I do think politicals are

[00:37:21] [SPEAKER_02]: actually net neutral like like elections they're net neutral because people spend so much more

[00:37:25] [SPEAKER_02]: time online right like I mean people are just wanting to fight people on a planet wanting to fight

[00:37:31] [SPEAKER_02]: people on Twitter going to Facebook comments right like I think in a year like this there's been

[00:37:37] [SPEAKER_02]: an assassination attempt there's been a you know sitting president dropped out there's been

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_02]: all of this type of shit I just think time on internet is just going up and at the same

[00:37:47] [SPEAKER_02]: point yeah I mean political spending will be five billion dollars but I think team move spent

[00:37:51] [SPEAKER_02]: for a billion dollars last year like I'm just making these numbers out but uh I do think there's

[00:37:56] [SPEAKER_02]: like a one-to-one comparison there but the differences we get the benefit of an in-rage population

[00:38:00] [SPEAKER_03]: who are spending a lot of time in yeah the dude's scroll is actually good for advertising in a weird way

[00:38:05] [SPEAKER_04]: yeah that's fucked up you know it's everyone else's feed on Twitter just like beyond

[00:38:11] [SPEAKER_04]: annoying right now yeah it's so bad it's like the between I mean I get the politics stuff but

[00:38:18] [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what rabbit hole I accidentally got down but I'm getting like all this like anti-semitic

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_04]: stuff now well it's Israel Gaza it's it's it's it's crazy how much hate there is

[00:38:31] [SPEAKER_04]: out there you know like doom scrolling and I'm not just talking about that like there's everything like

[00:38:36] [SPEAKER_04]: people hating on everything it's it's crazy right now I'm having to I'm finding myself having

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_04]: Twitter is used to be my information source and and Instagram was like my happy source

[00:38:48] [SPEAKER_04]: and I'm like just having to put the information source down a lot more yeah I mean you

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_02]: yeah the the problem with a platform that like you know you can make money off of reach right

[00:39:01] [SPEAKER_02]: at their paying creators what I think is the correct thing to do I think every platform should pay

[00:39:07] [SPEAKER_02]: but it incentivizes people to be as outlined as just possible you just have to mute

[00:39:12] [SPEAKER_02]: words in accounts look I've muted so many words I'll show you my list you just gotta like please

[00:39:18] [SPEAKER_02]: yeah send it to Jasper drop a drop a check I want to see this yeah did I can't I cannot see

[00:39:26] [SPEAKER_02]: dead people and like bro I'm just trying to live my life selling wild so the internet I'm

[00:39:30] [SPEAKER_03]: an e-com focus tool for me so uh Elon's been on there a lot talking about algorithm updates too

[00:39:37] [SPEAKER_03]: like I think he I saw him yesterday acknowledge like there's certain things broke and that really

[00:39:40] [SPEAKER_03]: bother him right now and I think I'm with you Jason I don't get the that kind of content but I

[00:39:46] [SPEAKER_03]: I'd clearly clicked on something at some point because my feed is turned into absolute dog shit

[00:39:50] [SPEAKER_02]: and I don't I don't know what I did you don't mind as just memes now I follow a cat called

[00:39:55] [SPEAKER_02]: criminal simsons and they're just post like yeah yeah yeah yeah you can fire that over yeah look I

[00:40:06] [SPEAKER_03]: think uh Q4 coming up right which is what we've been talking about the the probably the thing that

[00:40:14] [SPEAKER_03]: especially this year the thing that goes top of mind for me is always how do you fight rising

[00:40:18] [SPEAKER_03]: CPMs like with the election with Q4 spending advertising just appears to get really expensive but

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_03]: now conversions go up obviously at those peak periods but you still got to think ahead um

[00:40:29] [SPEAKER_03]: which comes down to like what are all the alternative places that you can capture value we know that

[00:40:34] [SPEAKER_03]: so it's not just like a Facebook or Google thing it's where else do you capture and I think for us

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_03]: we've seen pretty decent success like beyond SMS email using um direct mail or post like we use

[00:40:46] [SPEAKER_03]: post pilot for the stuff but um with post pilot on lo me it's kind of nice because lo me's got this

[00:40:52] [SPEAKER_03]: really long purchase considerations like oh like I think 75% of the people who buy lo me

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_03]: have been thinking about it for longer than three months like three to 12 months so mail hitting

[00:41:05] [SPEAKER_03]: somebody's sort of actual inbox like real IRL inbox for the kids uh is his workout quite well for it

[00:41:12] [SPEAKER_03]: so we like post pilot quite a bit because it's just automated and we just put that thing on just let

[00:41:17] [SPEAKER_03]: and then the other thing we've used post pilot for on pili case is um re-engagement so if pili case

[00:41:24] [SPEAKER_03]: the purchase cycle the repeat purchase cycle is long so like our initial purchase is actually quite

[00:41:29] [SPEAKER_03]: short it's like I think it's under 30 days shot it's actually probably very similar to ridge like

[00:41:34] [SPEAKER_03]: surprisingly quick um but then people don't upgrade their phones for like two or three years

[00:41:41] [SPEAKER_03]: right and if since my assumption is that nobody gives shit about our brand

[00:41:45] [SPEAKER_03]: and because they don't care about the brand it's what are the ways that you can get back

[00:41:49] [SPEAKER_03]: in front of that person every two three four years uh and direct emails actually and I swear to

[00:41:54] [SPEAKER_03]: do it because we know who they are so if it's useful to people that's kind of what we use

[00:42:00] [SPEAKER_03]: like actual physical mail for and post pilot's actually been a great partner like I really like what they

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_03]: do I like the team um they've just been great I don't know Jason do you you've used them bunch too right

[00:42:10] [SPEAKER_04]: yeah we've been using them for a while and I agree it's uh first of all we want to work with

[00:42:15] [SPEAKER_04]: people who we know have like a lot of integrity and are really committed to providing a good service

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_04]: to their customers and they've been with us um I mean it probably two years now and you know we

[00:42:25] [SPEAKER_04]: first start out with look as our media mix has has changed that's just our media mix has expanded

[00:42:31] [SPEAKER_04]: it keeps expanding you know you're talking about rising cpm's and q4 etc where we're at

[00:42:38] [SPEAKER_04]: you know there's only so much we can spend on better I mean I think I keep having this fight

[00:42:43] [SPEAKER_04]: with my team and but I never win because of the long um purchase consideration period but

[00:42:49] [SPEAKER_04]: yeah we started using post pilot um you know for people in our uh in our database right people on our

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_04]: list I'm not sure if it was it was like you mentioned a band in card or not I'm sure it was

[00:43:01] [SPEAKER_04]: a combination of a number of things and then but what was interesting is we also texted just tested

[00:43:06] [SPEAKER_04]: just regular direct mail um because regular direct mail has been a marketing channel you know forever

[00:43:13] [SPEAKER_04]: the original direct response was direct mail and um and we had tested some other providers on

[00:43:20] [SPEAKER_04]: that too like some shared mailers and things like that that that would refer to me and then

[00:43:25] [SPEAKER_04]: you know just turned down like post pilot can just do it all for us rapid all in a bow

[00:43:29] [SPEAKER_04]: and I mean it's like a pretty good fully encapsulated into an solution for mail and I think if

[00:43:36] [SPEAKER_04]: a brand that has a real email list it's it's silly not to include that it's you some extent

[00:43:44] [SPEAKER_03]: in your media mix hmm and do um I think what they're doing now too is they've got I haven't tried this

[00:43:51] [SPEAKER_03]: but I want to which is they're actually doing like cold direct mail based on local likes so

[00:43:56] [SPEAKER_03]: like what we like about it because I peel a case especially it's gonna really small team

[00:44:01] [SPEAKER_03]: like we run really lean and direct mail is a beast unto itself like picking addresses and

[00:44:08] [SPEAKER_03]: doing doing all that coordination but what I like with post pilot is they kind of hook right into

[00:44:13] [SPEAKER_03]: clavio and Shopify and then they do all the address matching so it's like it's it's almost as

[00:44:17] [SPEAKER_03]: automated as direct mail can get but I think what they're doing now too is they've got a whole

[00:44:22] [SPEAKER_03]: look like AI look alike thing I'm actually not a technical of how it works

[00:44:28] [SPEAKER_03]: where they can give you prospecting lists much like Facebook can but it's like prospecting

[00:44:33] [SPEAKER_03]: but for direct mail which is kind of cool I haven't tried I'm gonna try it uh I think we were talking

[00:44:39] [SPEAKER_03]: about doing this on Lomi recently but I also think I think that's like I'm sure we're using it

[00:44:43] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm sure we're using it I can check with Andrew our had a retention who runs yeah um I'm sure

[00:44:48] [SPEAKER_04]: we're using you know we're leveraging everything they do they've been a really good partner for us

[00:44:55] [SPEAKER_00]: postcript is the only SMS solution you should be using as a brand store owner because

[00:44:58] [SPEAKER_00]: their sole focus is on SMS did the biggest innovators in the space and their latest launch

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_00]: of postcript AI is proof of this I got to see the demo a couple months back and immediately wanted

[00:45:07] [SPEAKER_00]: in on the beta and over the course of a four week period postcript generated for ridge over $124,000

[00:45:13] [SPEAKER_00]: in AI driven revenue we used to hold out so I can confidently say 12,000 if that is purely incremental

[00:45:19] [SPEAKER_00]: a 9% lift in browser abandonment 14% on checkout and our best performing abandoned cart flow

[00:45:25] [SPEAKER_00]: had a 29% lift on click through rate and a 21% lift on earnings per message should I say that

[00:45:30] [SPEAKER_00]: again but maybe a little slower 12,000 incremental revenue a 9% lift on our browser abandonment 14%

[00:45:37] [SPEAKER_00]: lift on our checkout abandonment and a 21% lift on our abandoned cart automation and the work

[00:45:42] [SPEAKER_00]: from our team was close to zero to generate these numbers. There's two things about postcript

[00:45:46] [SPEAKER_00]: AI that impersonately really excited about one is brand center it's essential nucleus of all

[00:45:51] [SPEAKER_00]: their AI message testing we get to feed them exactly how we want to sound what words to say

[00:45:56] [SPEAKER_00]: avoid who we want our personas to be and tune that over time to make sure our AI generated messaging

[00:46:01] [SPEAKER_00]: is on brand as much as possible I think brand center will power messaging everywhere potentially

[00:46:06] [SPEAKER_00]: right now we've just got it in our SMS flows but I think you go a lot more places the second one

[00:46:11] [SPEAKER_00]: is now that you've got this brand center you can do infinity testing so you can imagine maybe once twice

[00:46:17] [SPEAKER_00]: three times a quarter we're setting up an AB test to understand is this message better than

[00:46:22] [SPEAKER_00]: infinity testing does that in the background constantly testing hundreds and thousands of

[00:46:26] [SPEAKER_00]: variations to identify the optimal messaging given each flow when I first heard this described it

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_00]: immediately made me think that AB testing feels very archaic so I'm incredibly excited about

[00:46:36] [SPEAKER_00]: both brand center and infinity testing so if you're in D to see marketing you need to check this out

[00:46:40] [SPEAKER_00]: they've completely transformed how the team at Ridge is approaching SMS go to postcript.io slash

[00:46:45] [SPEAKER_03]: to learn more. John you mentioned a team of earnings just came out do you want to hit on

[00:46:54] [SPEAKER_03]: team a bit and kind of your thesis or what you mentioned before I'm like I guess thinking

[00:47:00] [SPEAKER_03]: ahead to Q4 right like what are all the variables that smaller brands are going to be up against

[00:47:05] [SPEAKER_03]: and last year team it was a big conversation and then Amazon primed in October was a bit of a

[00:47:12] [SPEAKER_03]: good show so do you want to take us away let's talk to you move for a second yeah well

[00:47:19] [SPEAKER_02]: prime the in October is coming back we know we don't have the exact days confirmed but

[00:47:24] [SPEAKER_02]: you should have your deals planned you should talk to your app because it's never as big as July

[00:47:29] [SPEAKER_02]: but it will be five external moments or something so like lean and there be a team of earnings

[00:47:34] [SPEAKER_02]: just came out. team was a publicly traded Chinese company called PDD and I've never believed

[00:47:39] [SPEAKER_02]: their numbers I mean if if this is shocking to you you should look up the history of publicly

[00:47:47] [SPEAKER_02]: traded Chinese companies on the US Stock Exchange probably 60% of them have had fraud attack

[00:47:53] [SPEAKER_02]: to them the most common or most like well known one is a luck in coffee I think luck in coffee

[00:48:00] [SPEAKER_02]: was publicly traded maybe actually I was on the Chinese Stock Exchange but then I take them down

[00:48:05] [SPEAKER_02]: and there's a big fraud thing about it they're just they're just pretty infamous for

[00:48:09] [SPEAKER_02]: boosting their numbers and lying about shit and even if they're audited they're typically

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_02]: audited by the Chinese arm of whatever public like you know your KPMG or big four or whatever

[00:48:22] [SPEAKER_02]: and they just they want to be in business with those people like it's the whole

[00:48:26] [SPEAKER_02]: double edge sort of like a the audit firm the audit firm wants to tell you what you want so that

[00:48:30] [SPEAKER_02]: you'll pay them more money next year like it's very hard to get an audit firm who's actually

[00:48:33] [SPEAKER_02]: on bias because you pay for them but anyway I have never trusted these numbers why are

[00:48:38] [SPEAKER_02]: trusted these numbers is because before team who came out the PDD which is very popular in China

[00:48:43] [SPEAKER_02]: they've even they've even app called uh I can't pronounce it but it's it's very very popular over there

[00:48:50] [SPEAKER_02]: and there were worth $250 billion publicly traded in China worth $250 billion which is

[00:48:59] [SPEAKER_02]: bigger than Disney I'm just gonna throw that out there but like uh I don't think I don't think

[00:49:06] [SPEAKER_02]: PDD the holder of team who is worth more than Disney right or worth more than Ali Baba that's the

[00:49:11] [SPEAKER_02]: thing they were more than Ali Baba Ali Baba also popular in China also popular very here I'll

[00:49:17] [SPEAKER_02]: look him up right now Ali Baba is worth $195 billion so team who was more valuable than they were

[00:49:25] [SPEAKER_02]: didn't make a lot of sense to me I thought they were they were lying about their numbers

[00:49:28] [SPEAKER_02]: today they had earnings just came out I think they say they revenue grew 86% or whatever right

[00:49:33] [SPEAKER_02]: but they said they're not gonna grow anymore and if that growth is challenging and they're

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_02]: in terms of very challenging environment we're gonna cut off bad suppliers and just focus on high quality

[00:49:42] [SPEAKER_02]: suppliers the market did not like it stock felt 30% so 60 billion dollars in market

[00:49:50] [SPEAKER_02]: guy value wiped out and I just I've always thought it wasn't a real company um I think this is a

[00:49:57] [SPEAKER_02]: good piece of news for us but what's up Jason well when you look this is this is China

[00:50:03] [SPEAKER_04]: right this is you have no idea that's that's the point like you you literally have no idea what's

[00:50:09] [SPEAKER_04]: going on there where the money is coming from who who decided to spend it I think the bigger issue

[00:50:17] [SPEAKER_04]: with the teams of the world is that there is no like this is sounds like an area for for government

[00:50:24] [SPEAKER_04]: regulation like in the US where you guys they can just they can just come in and spend on godly

[00:50:31] [SPEAKER_04]: it's anti-competitive in that respect right like that's that's the thing that I see about team move

[00:50:38] [SPEAKER_04]: so look I hope I hope they're pulling back I hope that they basically blew their wad and are now

[00:50:47] [SPEAKER_04]: they're like okay this is because eventually the money runs out right it's like the Fed can't just

[00:50:53] [SPEAKER_04]: like the Fed can't keep printing money necessarily at least they shouldn't um it's just to me

[00:51:00] [SPEAKER_04]: when when China is behind it and I'm not a China hate or I'm not a Chinese person hate or

[00:51:07] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm more about if you look at the Chinese government pushing these things making decisions

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_04]: what their strategic rationale is you know they they can they can leverage up and down

[00:51:18] [SPEAKER_04]: as much as they want and so there's some kind of strategic decision behind the whole thing

[00:51:23] [SPEAKER_04]: that we just don't know what it is but um they can they can keep throwing gobs among

[00:51:29] [SPEAKER_04]: if they want to and apparently they're deciding for some reason not which I think is net net great

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_03]: for everyone it's going to be interesting to see where that pullback comes if it's US based if it's

[00:51:41] [SPEAKER_03]: global house meta getting impacted by this from an earnings perspective like how much

[00:51:47] [SPEAKER_02]: money was team who actually spending on meta yeah I mean I think it's I think they said 4% of

[00:51:52] [SPEAKER_02]: total spend came from Chinese advertisers right and so you know 4% of 140 billion dollars

[00:51:59] [SPEAKER_02]: or whatever it's time of fucking money how much is Timo I mean is it a quarter as a half who knows

[00:52:05] [SPEAKER_02]: right but you know going back to Jason's point about like I think people get into a fever about

[00:52:11] [SPEAKER_02]: this that like you know there's nationalism of life right and it's like look they're definitely

[00:52:16] [SPEAKER_02]: gonna be anti-dumping laws those are the laws that like the US mattress companies have

[00:52:21] [SPEAKER_02]: pushed on you cannot buy a mattress from China it's impossible right because they're like

[00:52:26] [SPEAKER_02]: they're they're dumping shitty inventory on our on our domestic industry and they're shutting

[00:52:30] [SPEAKER_02]: us down and now all mattresses in America are made in America they have to be it's a kind of like

[00:52:35] [SPEAKER_02]: this weird tariff law so you could there's there's an anti-dumping argument for somebody like Timo

[00:52:42] [SPEAKER_02]: but there's actually I have like no nationalism qualms been to China love it whatever

[00:52:48] [SPEAKER_02]: it's just they have like China is still so early in the stock market the US had enron right and

[00:52:55] [SPEAKER_02]: that created all of this regulation that like it's very hard to do corporate fraud corporate fraud

[00:52:59] [SPEAKER_02]: still happens right like there was the guy from I mean maybe it was it was bedbath in beyond

[00:53:05] [SPEAKER_02]: who killed himself look the CFO right because he was committing corporate fraud I mean

[00:53:09] [SPEAKER_02]: allegedly I don't really know the details so I'm sorry for saying that if that's wrong

[00:53:12] [SPEAKER_02]: but we had enron and then it got really hard to commit public stock fraud they just haven't

[00:53:17] [SPEAKER_02]: had enough shit like that so they just commit fraud a bunch like that that's like I don't think

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_02]: they I don't think the Chinese government says they're in the involved if anything they hate

[00:53:26] [SPEAKER_02]: big attack and they've actually tried to squash alley bobbins deal money from them but

[00:53:31] [SPEAKER_02]: my big thing is like I don't trust the fucking stock and they just said they're not going

[00:53:35] [SPEAKER_02]: to be growing anymore and the stock market hated it it's probably a net net win for all of

[00:53:41] [SPEAKER_03]: us on this pod totally great Jason why don't you bring us home and tell us something positive

[00:53:45] [SPEAKER_03]: or is your panzerism going to be uh I'm gonna I'm a terrible human kind of one or are we

[00:53:52] [SPEAKER_04]: not ripping on a candidate I'm not ripping on all your vacations although I know you've got

[00:53:57] [SPEAKER_04]: a really good one plant that I'm super jealous yeah it's common super jealous when is that one

[00:54:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I leave on September 30th for Italy and I was so yeah I just have my family here for from there

[00:54:12] [SPEAKER_03]: came here for five days and it was I think it was a good preview lots of food lots of wine

[00:54:17] [SPEAKER_03]: lots of me bumbling around really bad Italian uh that was it was fun

[00:54:25] [SPEAKER_04]: yeah look I'll keep it quick it's just funny I haven't done a panzerism in a while

[00:54:29] [SPEAKER_04]: I mean you guys just create such good content you don't need me but just thinking about the

[00:54:36] [SPEAKER_04]: elements of success for a professional and just meeting so many great people

[00:54:45] [SPEAKER_04]: food my hexclad journey in young people older people

[00:54:51] [SPEAKER_04]: everyone talks about your network is your net worth I love that but that's not what this this is

[00:54:57] [SPEAKER_04]: inside what I want to talk about is is your appearance I think people don't take this

[00:55:06] [SPEAKER_04]: seriously enough this goes back like decades in my career um your appearance matters

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_04]: and it doesn't matter how some more you are it doesn't matter how good at you are your job

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_04]: like you could still be really great and really successful but if you layer on top of that

[00:55:27] [SPEAKER_04]: a great appearance like that's that's a rocket booster to your success and I just see

[00:55:34] [SPEAKER_04]: too many people that don't really care about that and it and like I said it won't stop you

[00:55:41] [SPEAKER_04]: like not having a great appearance is not going to stop you and when I say appearance doesn't

[00:55:45] [SPEAKER_04]: mean you need to be like the best looking person it's just like putting yourself together a certain

[00:55:52] [SPEAKER_04]: way that leaves a mark and if you're a highly skilled at what you do and are really great

[00:56:02] [SPEAKER_04]: at what you do that definitely could be enough for tremendous success but this is an additional

[00:56:11] [SPEAKER_04]: lever right and everyone should just be looking for like what is there next what is an additional

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_04]: lever I'm looking for additional levers for hexclad you know always and you know there are

[00:56:22] [SPEAKER_04]: people listening to the pod who are just trying to build their career and I think you know

[00:56:31] [SPEAKER_04]: appearances is a huge one I think there are a lot of younger people that like don't they don't

[00:56:35] [SPEAKER_04]: think they need they need that and when you're really young and early early 20s or even in mid 20s

[00:56:42] [SPEAKER_04]: and you're just grinding like the most important thing is to grind for sure but don't

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_04]: forget that when you meet people unfortunately or fortunately for wherever it may be like

[00:56:54] [SPEAKER_04]: people look at you and that's like that impression that you give people

[00:56:59] [SPEAKER_04]: it matters and it helps so just people should recognize that a parent's matters no matter how

[00:57:08] [SPEAKER_04]: no matter how smart or how good you are at your job your appearance matters that's it.

[00:57:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Sean I'm curious you take on this one this is good I wasn't expecting this Jason I like it

[00:57:17] [SPEAKER_02]: you say because I believe it's kind of the pod absolutely we're not I'm saying because you're

[00:57:26] [SPEAKER_02]: the youngest person on the pot. Well yeah I would I would put what Jason says in the

[00:57:33] [SPEAKER_02]: category there's like the base level is basic hygiene you have to brush your teeth you have to be clean

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_02]: okay it is like it is this like rules zero right and then it is you have to wear clean clothes

[00:57:49] [SPEAKER_02]: and then and then you can wear a nice clothes so that's later three it's like just I've always

[00:57:54] [SPEAKER_02]: loved fashion right I have like I've been more money on clothes than I've been I really should

[00:58:01] [SPEAKER_02]: but like I never like you could just learn basics right just go on men's fashion by sound

[00:58:05] [SPEAKER_02]: credit it's like just wear a shirt a jacket you know non-denum pants you got a fucking down

[00:58:12] [SPEAKER_02]: and then then level four would be uh just being in shape it's time right you don't have to

[00:58:19] [SPEAKER_02]: have fucking six pack in a professional setting but like that's that's level four you don't have

[00:58:23] [SPEAKER_02]: if you just get the level one you're fine right just like basic human you know hygiene and then

[00:58:30] [SPEAKER_04]: normal ass clothes I think that's totally fine Jason and by the way by the way there's

[00:58:36] [SPEAKER_04]: you can take it too far you know like the super flashy guys post in their Rolex is on Twitter

[00:58:42] [SPEAKER_04]: in their 20s and 30s is kind of silly I mean get the Rolex sure but like don't post it and the

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_04]: guys that are like totally shredded all the time too to me it's like you probably should spend more

[00:58:57] [SPEAKER_02]: working that's your job at that point yeah I mean yeah I like there was a guy in the whole

[00:59:06] [SPEAKER_02]: civil world he had like a whole cellier and I met him with him and I'm like oh your whole thing is just

[00:59:11] [SPEAKER_02]: your handsome guy like you're like I'm like that's your whole business right like he's like always doing

[00:59:17] [SPEAKER_02]: his hair always wearing the coolest clothes whatever and I'm like bro that is so cringe so you can

[00:59:22] [SPEAKER_04]: definitely take it too far no that's what you're in matters in both directions it's a perception

[00:59:29] [SPEAKER_03]: that you care thing right so like I've always I agree with this by the way Jason I think for me

[00:59:36] [SPEAKER_03]: it's been I find that like if you're if you're young in your career right or you're working

[00:59:42] [SPEAKER_03]: for somebody else and you're in an entrepreneurial organization like driven people tend to want to

[00:59:50] [SPEAKER_03]: be around other driven people and there's like it's just another signal that you actually

[00:59:55] [SPEAKER_03]: give a shit about how you're showing up in the world so for me I think it would be dishonest

[01:00:03] [SPEAKER_03]: to say that I like I don't bias towards like people who just genuinely look like they care right

[01:00:08] [SPEAKER_03]: they try like you're just trying like it's sort of that old thing of like how you do something

[01:00:12] [SPEAKER_03]: is how you do everything so it's like if you show up and you clearly haven't bathed today

[01:00:19] [SPEAKER_03]: that's not a positive signal to the people you work with so I think there's like I like the levels

[01:00:25] [SPEAKER_03]: things on but yeah I know I actually think it's really good advice like I think my grandfather gave

[01:00:30] [SPEAKER_03]: me that advice when I was a kid is like just the world's gonna judge you for your cover whether

[01:00:35] [SPEAKER_04]: you like it or not yeah they're maybe I'm not saying that it's the world is right for doing it

[01:00:40] [SPEAKER_03]: no but that's just that's just it it's the worst it's the game are they just are yeah right yeah

[01:00:46] [SPEAKER_02]: I remember what this one comes to beards like we were happy but dude I hate having a

[01:00:53] [SPEAKER_02]: fucking beard because every day it's different it just continues to grow and it's so hard to

[01:00:58] [SPEAKER_04]: maintain it it's so true it's honestly it's so true but it's better than having a shape every morning

[01:01:06] [SPEAKER_03]: that's the optionality is nice like we went from uh teamo and quarterly reports to face face here

[01:01:14] [SPEAKER_03]: I think we should wrap it on our face here all right boys I think that's the pod

[01:01:22] [SPEAKER_02]: talks in you made it an amazing episode at the operators podcast thank you for being here

[01:01:28] [SPEAKER_02]: thank you for listening thank you for describing the news letter thank you Jeff Affil the best

[01:01:32] [SPEAKER_02]: sponsor on earth nor to be in post-crip they're tied for two of the best sponsors on earth love

[01:01:38] [SPEAKER_02]: then what would they do for us thank you for being here subscribe like share follow me on Twitter

[01:01:44] [SPEAKER_02]: follow me on Twitter follow me guys on Twitter tactulated goodbye